24 Hour Lee Copus: Gut Health, IBD, IBS, Crohn's and Fibre Dangers

Lee is sometimes known as "the poop guy" because of his successful experience with the carnivore diet. He struggled with depression and was eventually diagnosed with ulcerative colitis in 2012. Despite taking medications and following recommended dietary advice, his condition worsened, and he ended up having surgery to remove his colon in 2014. The surgery left him feeling depressed and isolated. After hearing about the benefits of the carnivore diet from Michaela Peterson, Lee decided to give it a try. Lee shares his experience dealing with Crohn's disease for over a decade. He talks about the initial misdiagnosis and how he was put on multiple medications that only suppressed his symptoms. He also talks about the lack of guidance or advice given by doctors on diet and lifestyle. He credits his recovery to the carnivore diet which he has been following for the past two years. He also talks about his recent surgery and how his recovery was much faster due to his strict diet. He explains how his health deteriorated while he was on a plant-based diet and how he discovered the benefits of a meat-based, carnivorous lifestyle. He also shares how he can now see undigested plant materials in his stool and how they caused him discomfort and health issues. Some people may raise concerns about feeding their kids an all-carnivore diet, but there is evidence that humans have been eating predominantly animal protein for thousands of years and that this is a healthy and nutrient-dense way to eat. Others may feel jealous that they didn't discover this lifestyle earlier in their own lives and wish they could have fed their children this way from the start. It's important to give children the choice and educate them about real nutrition.

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Transcript

24 Hour Lee Copus Transcript

Summary

Lee is sometimes known as "the poop guy" because of his successful experience with the carnivore diet. He struggled with depression and was eventually diagnosed with ulcerative colitis in 2012. Despite taking medications and following recommended dietary advice, his condition worsened, and he ended up having surgery to remove his colon in 2014. The surgery left him feeling depressed and isolated. After hearing about the benefits of the carnivore diet from Michaela Peterson, Lee decided to give it a try. Lee shares his experience dealing with Crohn's disease for over a decade. He talks about the initial misdiagnosis and how he was put on multiple medications that only suppressed his symptoms. He also talks about the lack of guidance or advice given by doctors on diet and lifestyle. He credits his recovery to the carnivore diet which he has been following for the past two years. He also talks about his recent surgery and how his recovery was much faster due to his strict diet. He explains how his health deteriorated while he was on a plant-based diet and how he discovered the benefits of a meat-based, carnivorous lifestyle. He also shares how he can now see undigested plant materials in his stool and how they caused him discomfort and health issues. Some people may raise concerns about feeding their kids an all-carnivore diet, but there is evidence that humans have been eating predominantly animal protein for thousands of years and that this is a healthy and nutrient-dense way to eat. Others may feel jealous that they didn't discover this lifestyle earlier in their own lives and wish they could have fed their children this way from the start. It's important to give children the choice and educate them about real nutrition.

 Transcription

So somebody is asking, why is everyone doing a 24 hour stream right now? King carnivore is doing one too. I'm confused. Right, okay. How it works is we are not protective. We are very much, you know, if people are going to be our guests, then we can give them the, the, the keys to the kingdom. They can they can do it to their own channel. So although I set this streamyard link up for me, Richard has his own one and he has his own one, and, uh, Jonathan's got his own one and he's got his own one. But it all originates from here. But the good thing is, you see, because many, many more people have subscribed to Anthony Schaefer's YouTube than ours, he will do it directly to his channel, because he's got all these people that haven't bothered to subscribe to Rich himself because, you know, we're in the UK and, uh, they're quite happy to subscribe into Anthony. So, uh, that's how that's working for those that are confused. Lee should be popping into the studio any moment at 830. Uh, I thought he might be in a little bit early, but they go. He hasn't come. So last year. To my eternal shame, when I look at the playbacks, I was I was a bit disconnected as I am now because there's so much going on, so many comments. So I guess we've got to get in. So if I miss, if I miss one of your, um, questions or comments, I do apologize. And as if by magic and only as you like. He's sitting there looking wonderful in the full glow of the wonderful Kent sunshine. Here he is. Hey, Don. How you doing, man? Yeah. I'm good. I'm just lucky that I get the freshest. Uh, Richard and Stephen. Uh, I don't know about that. I haven't quite walking up yet, you know? Yeah. Good times. Like it's going to be great. Um, so I want to ask you, Lee, if you don't mind. Just for those that don't know you, if you could give us a little potted history of why you are so famous now. Um, I'm the poop guy, and no one calls me that. But, um. Yeah. So I wound up with an awesome bag. That's probably what I'm most, um, well known for. Um, but the reason why I went carnivore was to address my depression, which was a consequence of having a bag, basically. So if I go back to 2012, when I was first diagnosed with my first health problem, and that turned out to be ulcerative colitis. So an inflammatory bowel disease, much like Crohn's except for it exclusively affects the colon. And so, you know, nasty symptoms at first was quite mild. But you know, typical things like blood when you go to the toilet, which was a little bit of a shock, obviously. And that's the reason why I went and saw the doctor and went about getting my diagnosis. And so this was all in 20. This was 2012 and I wasn't taking medications until 2014. So yeah, start to take steroids as things got a little bit worse. I was told to eat more fiber, whole grains, vegetables, fruits and this kind of thing. Um, as well as taking these medications. Um, and three years later, I wound up in hospital on my worst flare yet. It was just so bad I was going to the toilet sort of 30 times a day. Um, which was just exhausting. And, uh, I felt like there was no going back. There was something about this flare that was just so bad, you know, I knew that something had to change, that most likely, I was, um. Heading for surgery. But, you know, when I was in the hospital, they tried their best to avoid that. And so they were keeping me on steroids to keep the inflammation down and try me on my immune suppressants and things like that, which didn't work. I think it was about 50 over 50 that I was going to get myself a remission and go home with my colon and then be on like sort of strong medications for life kind of thing. Um, but yeah, it didn't work. They kept me on the drugs for a couple of days longer. Then they said that they should anyway. And so the very next morning I ended up having the surgery. Um, they took my whole colon out, so I don't have any part of the colon. So, um, the last part of my digestive tract is the ilium, hence the ileostomy surgery. And so I basically have all my digestive tract intact all the way down to the last part, small intestine. Um, and so it wasn't until I got home, actually, that I, the depression hit me, you know, and it was pretty quick, honestly. Um, I went back to my parents house for obvious reasons. They could sort of help and take care of. I wasn't able to do things, and, um, well, I woke up the first morning and they had all gone to work and I was just quite quiet, and I realized that I wasn't really happy with what happened. You know, it was it was kind of like, um, they happen really fast. When I was in the hospital, I felt okay. I felt like I was in the right place. I didn't feel so strange. But at the moment I returned back to a familiar place. Um, it was quite obvious, you know, I wasn't really happy with things. The way it felt, the way it looked. Having this bag now fashioned to my stomach, which I had to take everywhere I went and it caused problems with sleep. It was a bit restricted, so I felt like I was kind of stuck on my back for a bit. And that also didn't help, you know, that's going to exacerbate my depression, not not being able to sleep and, and this kind of stuff. So it was just this vicious loop. And, um, yeah, I was looking for answers, you know? I eventually went back to work and got back to my life. Probably fooled a lot of people putting on smiles and acting like I was okay, but deep down I was just, um. Just. Falling pretty fast and deep. You know, and constantly living my life in my head. Put myself down, finding any excuse not to go out. And, you know, I was single at the time and I was just kind of worried about my, the outcome really of my, my future and felt like I was going to be alone, which is very gloomy. And this is how I felt. Um, and actually, I reached out to my GP again to address my depression, and it wasn't until I, I basically went through, um, a service where I called a number and they were helping me refine how to treat my depression. And so they were kind of like getting me on file and getting things going. And I was anticipating this secondary call. And this call never came. But for the first few days, I felt pretty good because just getting stuff off my chest and feeling like I was getting the ball rolling, um, but they never called. And it wasn't until about a week I thought, I'm not sure. I'm not sure that they they're going to get back to me, you know, and for whatever reason, I didn't get the ball rolling again. I decided just to perhaps sit back and maybe wait for something else. Another idea. And it wasn't until I was sitting there just in my right, watching YouTube on the TV, and Michaela Peterson's anecdote came up. The low carb down under one was, don't, don't eat this. I think it's called I watched that and that was enough for me. I was convinced he like, okay, this is this potentially. My opportunity to fix myself because she also had autoimmune conditions and she was severely depressed. And the fact that she's standing there on the stage, you know, glowing with health, talking about how she's ameliorated all these, these symptoms, I thought, what have I got to lose? And so I talked to my partner, Lucy, and the next day we went to the store and jumped straight into PBB together. She was just being supportive. And yeah, the first two weeks were a bit rough because of energy, and I was very used to a heavy diet and not getting a lot of animal fats. And so this this adjustment was pretty extreme. So it was going to take some time. But those first two weeks felt like a long time. And I was really waiting every day I was like, you know, I don't feel any different. I don't feel any different. And then all of a sudden, three weeks, it's like it all just fell into place all at once, went to work in the morning, and I felt like I had so much energy just out of nowhere. Just I was just running on the energy. It was like, amazing, you know? No crashing. I wasn't thinking about food. I was really I realized I was smiling and I had all this energy walking around just feeling good about the day, you know? And then I realized, like, I'm not depressed. I feel really good. Pulled over and my van and just recorded my testimony because it was just so profound. And since that day in like day 21, I haven't had any symptoms of depression. You know, even on a bad day when everything's going wrong, I don't feel really down and gloomy. I'm not, like, so deep and and it's not dark for me anymore. Like, I can, I can cope and handle situations. I'm less reactive. I seem to just be a little bit more stable and, um, yeah, I just I'm happy, I feel good, and I just want to share this way of life. I want to help other people to treat their depression, their IBD. Because ironically, I've come to realize that this diet that ameliorated my depression would have also been the diet that would have given me the best chance to get out of trouble getting remission, maybe come off meds, and certainly avoid these big surgeries where I've, you know, I've lost a large organ in my body. And I would recommend I wouldn't recommend it. It's not it's not a good time and it affects everything because you can't. Wherever I go. The back goes. And it's kind of like it became my new boss for a long time, you know? Can I go for a walk? Shall I? Can I go to sleep? You know, is it a good time? And so it's a very strange thing, actually, especially when it hits you overnight when you in the in the beginning, I embraced it because I was so ill. I felt so poisoned, almost. I was just like, please just take it out. Just just get rid of it, you know? But. It's crazy. Like when once you, you come to, you know, and then you're in this situation, it's almost like, oh, man, I wish I could have gone back and and and done things right. Because the medications, their advice didn't help me, didn't serve me whatsoever. You know, if anything, it was the complete opposite of what I should have done. And it was the opposite of what they should have told me. It was poor advice. And and I'm coming to realize more and more, you know, we've been lied about so much, but these, um, these doctors, a lot of them, they're innocent. But it's this confirmation bias. And as Ken Barry would say, the echo a lie. So yeah, absolutely. I mean, one of the reasons I like having you around is, uh, firstly, you're very concise, full of information. That's greatly. And secondly, there's no malice in what you say. You're just repeating what actually happened to you and you're just echoing. We use that word again. Uh, what many people who come to us and say they feel not listened to, it doesn't make sense what they're being told to do. Uh, I've got somebody who very kindly signed up for a drug trial. Didn't tell me because I thought I would be a little bit, um, anti it. Well, let's just say, uh, all your chickens always come home to roost. So anyway, this person had got over cancer and was doing really well and very fit and healthy and was able to walk up the stairs and all this sort of stuff. But deep in their brain, they still believed in doctors more than anything else. And they were talking to try and medication because they had one side effect left from their chemotherapy. No other side effects. It was just it was quite small side effect. And I said, oh, we're doing a drug trial actually for that side effect. So here we are. We're looking at a drug or a therapy that's caused a side effect. And they're now looking at another medication to cause, uh, to try and get rid of the side effect caused by chemotherapy. But the point I'm making is they didn't want to tell me that they were doing the drug trial. I didn't know they were doing the drug trial. And six months ago they started. And six months ago I started to notice a deterioration. And it was really noticeable. Really noticeable. Uh, and that's why I'm always banging on about clinical presentation. And there were people monitoring, obviously, because it's a drug trial and they were having some really bad symptoms. And, um, it got to the point just last week where I just had to be really blunt and said, look, I know, I know you're doing something and I know you're a really nice person, so there's a reason why you're not telling me what you're doing. So I confessed to doing this drug trial, and I just said, um, so all these symptoms that you've been asking me about, which don't seem to make any sense. The only thing that makes sense is the, uh, is is the drug you're taking this experimental drug, and, um. They were like, yeah, I think so. Now to me that made me quite cross because I would have taken that person out of that trial within six weeks because the symptoms, they went from not having any problems walking up and down stairs, for instance, to not even be able to get upstairs within six weeks. You know, these these aren't small symptoms, constant pains in the chest area, which to me, such a big flag you would not believe. Yeah. Um, so I think we have to start listening to our own bodies. And even if you've got an expert saying something and they're very convincing, if you've got a problem, you've got to dig your heels and say, yeah, I hear what you're saying, and I appreciate everything, but it doesn't make any sense for me. And I think that's sort of a summary. A summary of what comes across when I listen to your videos is how you were confused by it all. I think, yeah, that's the thing is when especially when you're diagnosed with something and it gives you a bit of a shock, you worry. And so you and certainly back then, you know, I was quite loopy, although I didn't really question things too much. And I think that we trust those professionals, you know, when we're in trouble we're a little bit scared, you know, and we want to do right by ourselves, but we end up listening to people that have absorbed the wrong information, and they aren't qualified to give you meaningful advice because they're often just giving you a drug, a magic pill that, that, that only you know obviously suppresses your symptoms. And, um, interestingly, you know, when I first started taking these, these steroids, they're pretty miraculous in the beginning, you know, that the effect that they have while you're on them, at least, um, that's the thing with steroids, the moment you come off any steroid, those sort of so-called magical, um, effects that they have, they just instantly wear off the moment you actually have to continue to take them. Everybody knows that the bodybuilders, the moment you stop taking it, you're not going to maintain that kind of composition and muscle mass. So. Yeah, it's interesting because at first I was thinking, this is great. You know, my flares aren't so bad and I can kind of cope a bit better. I can even go to work on a flare because the frequency of our movements were significantly reduced. But every time I flared, it could be like, you know, because it wasn't that often in the beginning. I think people might not realize that it starts with sort of bouts of diarrhea and blood. Um, but this might last 2 or 3 weeks, and then you get back to feeling like a normal person. You can just, you know, go out and nobody knows you've got any problems. I don't know that I've got any problems. There's no pain, um, or even discomfort. But when those flares come on, I remember there was sort of like a funny feeling almost just coursing through my veins. You can feel you don't feel quite right. And your body gives in and then you flare up and yeah, they can be quite intense. And these obviously just got worse. And I think that drugs they, they can kind of you know when you suppress things they come back with vengeance. And I think your body's almost like trying to fight the drug as well, which is crazy. And then obviously the fiber and the plant proteins, the cells, even spicy food, dairy would have maybe caused me issues and certainly alcohol. I mean, you can't can't afford to be consuming any of these things when you're suffering that chronically with IBD. You know? And what's amazing is that considering it's a gut problem, it's right in your digestive tract where food trucks through, they didn't even really talk about food other than drink a beer and night on Doctor Said. And the other one said, increase fiber intake these medications. That's the actual advice that I had. That's that's what I took away. I can't remember anything else. You know, I think actually the first thing that the first doctor said was, if you think it's bowel cancer, you can forget it. And so it was just it's all a bit of a funny the attitudes and their advice. Um, because at the time there was these, uh, bowel cancer awareness efforts and I suppose it was getting quite a lot of patients going in and being a bit paranoid and maybe got a bit fed up, and he took it out of me, I don't know. But, um, obviously I was young, so yes, it would have been unlikely, but, uh, it's not very helpful. And, you know, what did I learn? Doctors are supposed to teach and guide us and be open, you know that. But they're very sort of prideful and and they don't like to be wrong. And obviously, recently I've had my final surgery, which again, wasn't to do with carnivore, just in case of wondering. It's been on the cards for practically eight years and where they'd left just a little stomach that's connecting to the anus of the rectum and the anus just five centimeters of tissue. And so in my mind, okay, this has to be removed. Get it done within ten years because that's, you know, just to be safe. Um, and it'll be a quick in-and-out situation because I've only got removed five centimeters of tissue. Well, this surgery I've just recovered from, um, was bigger than the last. It was. It had sort of. Other things that other complications where they they deemed it safer to put stents in both my ureters and this kind of stuff. And so it was very invasive and it was very inflammatory. My my body wasn't happy at all. I think the fact that I've been very strict carnivore as well for a long time, well, two years now, basically, um, so close to two years before I had the surgery. Um, you must build up extra sensitivity. So I think if I went in there and had an end to your shake, and you're full of all these steroids and all these drugs and the mistakes, and then you start eating off the menu, I think I would have felt terrible, you know, Um, lucky for me, obviously, I had my mum, my dad and Lucy bringing foods and things like that, and Richard, your electrolytes and all that kind of stuff. So proper clean, clean stuff going into my system. Um, and that helped. I recovered very fast. And again, I owe that to Carnival because last time I was in hospital with a slightly smaller soda, I now had my whole colon taken out. But in terms of the scar tissue, in terms of what actually went down, it wasn't so inflammatory. And I was in hospital for 12 days and it took me about four days to walk, and I wasn't eating until about 6 or 7 days, where this time I walked 20 hours after my surgery. I was eating about two days later, um, I went home in two days less time, and as soon as I came home and everything was removed, all the medications came at everything. So I just recovered like that and I went to I was actually back at work cleaning windows five weeks and three days or five weeks and four days after my surgery, which was just crazy, really, you know, that that wouldn't have happened last time, then I can only really think the carnival has everything to do with that. You know, all of the foods that I was eating is exactly what I needed to build myself back and allow the skin to heal. I've got very nice, healthy scar, you know, that healed super quick and no problems. No, no, no weeping, no anything. So it was just an ordeal that I had to face. And I'm just glad that it's behind me now so I can kind of move on with my life and close that chapter for good. Yeah, they think so much. I mean, can I just deal with some of the comments in the chat? We are looking at the chat. Um, I am starving. All the questions that are due to come up. We do have guests as well and I want to thank people for the super chat, which like we say is really handy. Um, we will get to every question. We've got 24 hours. Now. One of the things you might have noticed is, is we don't just glibly go, yeah, that's all right. Or we've got a video about that. We try to answer everything. So if you put a question at 8:00 and it's still not answered at 830, it's not because we've just ignored it. I've got 77 questions already. Um, start to be answered. All right. And we're only 46 minutes into a 24 hour live stream, so we're going to try and get to everything. Um, if we don't get to your question, you can always watch the playback. Don't forget. And also I'll be chunking this into there's going to be 24 videos at the end of this. There's going to be basically 24 different individual hours and it'll all be timestamps. So if you put a question on say let's say 8:00 and we haven't answered it by 847 and you've got to go, well, you can then find it maybe in the next section or the next section because it will be out there. So I know a lot of people are looking on other channels like Anthony Sophie's channel. Thank you so much Anthony, I know you're not there at the moment, but you know, it's great that you're streaming this to all your subscribers, which is really great. So if you've got a question for Anthony, then I'm trying to keep it for when when he comes on. So that's that's that. Um, sorry to monopolize Rich. I just want to ask Lee one quick question and then you can get in and ask him some questions or if you've seen something in the chat. Lee. But one of the things that's interesting about your journey is you can categorically prove that meat does not rot in your colon. So if you want to just tell me how you can prove that. Yeah, 100%. So, um, interestingly, when I came out of the hospital and I came home, I was quite, um, I was looking forward to eating the food that put me there without even thinking about it. I just went back and all the same foods. And so for a long time I was eating pretty much everything. I had curries, burgers and chips, I had salads, I had sort of spag bowls and lasagna, all these, these kind of cliched dishes that we were like. And, um, I was noticing for the first time, obviously, as I've got a bag and you've got this little pink window and I empty the bag and things like that. So, um, all of a sudden I'm seeing the steak that food's in by the time it would enter the colon, because as it goes into my bag, that's exactly the point where it now be entering the colon. So I'm saying all these different plant materials that are in digested and intact. And the interesting thing obviously is where it hasn't reached the colon yet. It's quite liquidy. And so what I see is something completely different to what I'm even myself with, with my colon before would be able to see if I sort of stopped and look, look behind and think, oh right, okay, so everything's totally different. You're seeing what's swimming around in fluid, if that makes sense. And all I could see was like mushrooms and pineapple, nuts and seeds and all these different sort of, uh, broken up pieces of plant. You can tell what they were because there was chunks of it, you know, you got like broccoli florets and bits of pineapple and stuff like that. Yet there was no meat. There was no, you know, fish and and butter, all that stuff. It doesn't it doesn't end up in the bag and you can recognize it. It's completely broken down and liquefy it sort of thing. And so it's funny, I'd never really questioned all this stuff until I had the bag. And now I'm back on the standard diet kind of thing. I'm eating a mixture of everything. I'm now noticing all these plant materials in the back. And so, um, yeah. And some things are definitely worse than others. And so when I eat pizza, things like mushroom, um, onions, pineapple, whatever, these, these were really, really bad. You know, potato starch is pretty bad, but it's it's kind of soft, like a banana. So it's more pliable. But but certain things will give me problems. Um, and the amount of times, you know, I'd have obstructions and like, indigestion and, and blockages and things like that from, like, mushrooms, mango, pineapple. Um, um, but cabbage, anything like that. Certainly raw. If you're going to eat like raw vegetables, that's, um, super inflammatory just because it doesn't break down whatsoever, you know, and it's just this roughage that's going to be traveling through your gut. And obviously now I'm thinking, oh my goodness, you know, where I had my colon. All these problems, these ulcers, all this stuff is like traveling through probably irritating the hell out of it. Um, which it did. You know, things like nuts and seeds. They almost act like sandpaper because they're really quite roughly, but, like sharp edges and corners that are just probably really irritating my bow. So no wonder I struggle with so much. And certainly when they gave me all this advice, you know, I was eating more of that stuff. I was making sure that my plate was really colorful and out of these whole plant foods. And so when you're eating whole plant foods, whether you cook them or not, they are a problem and they don't digest even the, you know, whether it's soluble or insoluble. It all ends up in the toilet. It really does. And I've seen it, but I've swallowed chunks of meat. Um, and, you know, if you look at a line, if you look at a dog when they're eating meat, they've also got very high acidic stomach acid, you know, they're very low pH and very similar to us. You don't see them sitting around chewing the meat all day long. And again, their stomach acid, it breaks it down entirely effortlessly. So it's not a problem. Um, but at the moment they plant, you'll see that you'll notice that the plants are in the stool. Um, and so if we don't digest Firebird, we don't digest even the proteins. Those things are not only pointless in, you know, consuming them because they're not going to offer a benefit, but they actually incur and inflict damage on your gut. Um, and exacerbate. If you've got things like IBD, diverticulitis, IBS, constipation, or diarrhea, it can exacerbate the symptoms of these these problems. Um, and yeah, I've done experiments over and over again and. There's no way I want to go back to eating plants, because having a bag is like a problem enough. And without having these plants in digestible portions of the plants struggle, you know, to even come around out in the bag. And so, yeah, if you if you wound up with a bag, you know, all, all the more reason to go carnivore because it just makes your life easier. You don't have that kind of discomfort all the time where you feel the food struggling as well. So. Richard. Yeah. Just listening to the story, it's interesting that, um, we have Lee speaking at an event in September and yourself and myself, um, which we're going to put a link into, into the description. But Lee will be there for, for lots of questions and Q&A. It's going to be a two day, uh, event. Uh, specifically towards the carnivore based lifestyle. Um, it's going to be an intimate event. Um, where all the speakers are there to to network and speak with all of the guests and speak about their experiences. Uh, so if you want the opportunity to, to speak with myself, Steven or Lee and many other amazing speakers, there is a link to that in in the description on my stream, and I'll pop it into the comments also. But it's an incredible story. It's um. It baffles me how damaging these products are. Um, people think that we are absolutely mental when we explain to them that all plants contain fatal actions, plant toxins, uh, some of which, you know will kill you immediately. And most plants on the planet are poisonous to to one species or the other. Um, an animal can fight back or it can run away. Plants are rooted to the grounds. They have these defense chemicals in their, um, and they do all sorts of things. They cause slow damage, uh, they cause long term damage, uh, and some of which will you can kill you with an incredibly low dose. Uh, I'm working on a video, so I have this on my desk. I don't know if you guys can see this, but this is a pack of, um, flaxseed. Uh, if you were to consume that much flaxseed, you would die. Without question. Flaxseed contains a CyanogenMod, like a so-called cinnamon, uh, which breaks down into cyanide. Yet we consume these products thinking that they're good for us. We add them to our bread or the cereal or smoothie. Um, but they are toxic, you know, and it's I quite often use the analogy and I've got, I've got a cup here, which isn't coffee, by the way, because I have quit coffee. There's nothing in there. But, you know, if I was to hand this to you and it was full of rat poison, this is going to kill you dead. Would you drink it now? The answer is going to be no, you know. But if I was to say, well, I'm going to put this much rat poison in there, but then I'm going to fill the rest of the cup full of vitamins and minerals, and it's going to I'm going to add stevia and you rest at all or whatever you want. Sugar. It could be anything. It's going to be the nicest tasting drink that you've ever tasted. But it does have this much rat poison. But that isn't enough to kill you that much rat poison won't kill you. Would you drink it? And the answer still going to be no. Yet we consume these compounds just because, you know we use that term well, the poisons in the dose, you know, and it's just stupid. And this this isn't a dig at anyone who is still consuming vegetable because we're all on, on an individual an individual journey. It's taken myself an awful long time to gravitate into carnivore. I come into this through ill health also, Stephen, for for the same reasons. But I've incremented these changes, you know, and I used to eat lots of vegetables, but they are toxic and they are damaging to the body. And I think your story is an incredible story. Um, you know, I'm. It's a shame that you've had to go through all this. But I think that, you know, the positives are coming from it because your story is so compelling. Your reach is incredible on YouTube especially, um, and I think that the word that you're spreading, you know, is a positive word and people will listen. The proof's in the pudding. As we say, it's just an incredible story. And it never it never ceases to to amaze me, um, and shocked me every time that you tell it. But, um, no, thank you for sharing it. No worries. Yeah. Can you believe some people will just put their abs? No, I just make up. You know, I've got a picture of me standing there with a bag and, like, this is just a good old laugh. I thought I'd pop on today and just lie about plants and fiber. And, you know, it's not essential for a reason. You know, we don't we don't require fiber for that benefit that everybody talks about feeds the gut. We get the exact same benefit from and actually better. It's more more of a thorough version of that benefit being in ketosis on a carnivore diet. Um, you're not inflaming your cells and your tissues, not irritating your gut, but you are nourishing every kernel site in your gut with the ketones circulating in your blood, rather than relying on the fiber to come in contact, which also means you're destroying microvilli in your small intestine. That means you're destroying your, you know, and wearing the way your gut lining and all this kind of stuff. And so, yeah, it's just not worth it. I don't know why anybody would like to eat all that fiber anyway. Now, you know, especially you start farting and my bag doesn't feel like with air and that it's just, uh, you know. Yeah. I think I want to show a question here because it's one that comes up and, uh, although, uh, it seems an obvious thing to to answer. We'll cover it. Caroline's asking, as someone new to kind of any advice for having kids aged four, seven, 13 taking part? Is there anything I should be concerned about? I want to flip that after what Lee said, for instance. You know, yeah, there's things to be concerned about in not eating carnivore. I mean, do you. Did you do this question? And this has not been horrible to you, Caroline. This is just trying to make people think differently. Do you ever question Pop Tarts, cereals, you know, food colorings, uh, the amount of sugar and fructose in in fruit or dried fruit juice, which is easy for me to say. You know, there's lots of things that you take for granted, like, uh, drinking net zero coke. Well, no one asks questions about that. I literally saw somebody yesterday with a big jug mixing a zero Coke with a protein shake and just saying, you know, there's no extra calories in this. This is fantastic. They were quite, um. Big as well, so they didn't look particularly healthy. Well, what you're asking, is there a problem with eating something that humans have eaten for 300,000 years? Is there a problem? You know, uh, obviously some sort of animal, as you can see behind him, he's been hunting, and, uh, that's what we did. We've done that for 300,000 years. And when you do stable isotope testing of long bones and teeth, teeth are a really good thing from any relic, any human remains, from any constant over any period of time will show you that we've eaten predominantly 80% animal protein, in fact, at least 80% for 300,000 years. As humans and all these modern diseases. There's a clue in that phrase from modern foods, and fruit is a modern food in the in, in the way it is presented now and how it's been changed to be hardy and sugary and addictive. And same with veg. You know, a lot of veg is just a mixture of one and the other, and it's more hardy and it's sprayed with pesticides. So four, seven and 13 should there, should you be concerned about anything. No, nothing at all. I don't, I don't see there's any problem with any other kind of diet because it's all whole foods, one ingredient food however you want to word it and that and that's pretty healthy. But I'll let the other guys have a go at this as well. Yeah. Do you want to jump in? Well, I mean, I think any any carnivore that struggle with their health and finally gone carnival and sort of found a robust health for the first time in their life. I think here in this, a lot of us get envious. So, you know, if you've got a child and they haven't been in carnival, it's like, oh man, I wish I knew this earlier so I could have stuck my kid on an animal based diet sooner. You know, and anyone like me, Rachel and Steven, we wish we'd found Carnival much sooner. I wish that my mum and my dad knew what I knew so that I could be carnival for life. So, um, no, absolutely no. No issues whatsoever. Um, your your child's going to thrive. Um, the body is designed to, you know, take on all those nutrients from animal products and animal sources. Yeah. For sure. And just reiterating what Steven said, I mean, we can we can see through nitrogen isotope testing up to 1.5 million years ago through Homo habilis that we were predominantly meat eaters also. Um, but this is an evolutionary appropriate diet. If we look at the cell in the body. Um, 70% of the cell on the average, uh, human cell is water. Um, so 70% is taken up with water as, as far as wheat goes out to the remaining 30%, 18% of that is protein. Then we have the next highest, which is a lipid, uh, which is around five. Only 2% of that of the weight of a cell is polysaccharide or sugar. Um, you know, that should tell you everything you need to know. I were born, for example, is made of proteins, minerals, proteins, protein and minerals. Every cell in the body is made of protein and fat. This is how we are designed to live. This is an evolutionary appropriate diet. Um, you know, if, um, any advice for kids. So, you know, is is it a case of trying to get them to maintain the lifestyle? Because I have a nine year old who I wish was carnivore. Um, I do think it's important to give them the choice rather than forcing them into a lifestyle I do. Educator. Uh, and make sure she understands what real nutrition is. In fact, in school recently, they asked every child in the class which was more nutrient dense, you know, vegetables or animal proteins. And she was the only one that said animal proteins. So super impressed. She knows that, um, the animal proteins are where we get our nutrients from at the age of nine. It doesn't mean that she loves to eat beef with me every day. But what I do, I my shop is done in my local butcher. I go to my local butcher and that's it. That's where all of my food comes from. Um, but I take her to Lidl supermarket and I let her buy anything that she wants, as long as it's a single ingredient food. So as long as it's a single ingredient food, she can have it. And this includes fruit because I want her just to eat real food first and foremost. Um, but I constantly reinforce in the fact that animal proteins are where we get our nutrients from vegetables and not as nutrient dense as as we're led to believe. And we can get deeper into this, I'm sure over the next 23 hours, as we do, I have two hours left to go.